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让我们支持Jan Wong

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71#
发表于 2006-10-2 20:02 | 只看该作者
兄弟此处用词欠妥,你说“完全”归化,那要包括政治经济与文化,满清掌控了政治与经济,但却丢失了文化,你看我汉人照说汉语,而不是满洲的语种。,[QUOTE=markelei00]
汉人在被满清短暂的几百年奴役之后就已经完全归化,  

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72#
发表于 2006-10-2 20:46 | 只看该作者
我用词上面要检讨. 有点过... 就是某些方面满清被汉同化了, 这样说可以吗?

Post by practice
兄弟此处用词欠妥,你说“完全”归化,那要包括政治经济与文化,满清掌控了政治与经济,但却丢失了文化,你看我汉人照说汉语,而不是满洲的语种。,[QUOTE=markelei00]
汉人在被满清短暂的几百年奴役之后就已经完全归化,  

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73#
发表于 2006-10-2 22:21 | 只看该作者

再次全力声援 JAN WONG!

再次全力声援 JAN WONG!

其实我不以为 JAN WONG 的文章本身和发表的时间有什么错;相反,大量移民的涌入更突出了 JAN WONG 涉及的问题的重要性和紧迫性。

加拿大是一个民主法制的社会固然没有错;但在此同时加国是一个金钱社会,亦是一个商品社会。然当连正义与否都是以钱衡量的话,那么司法本身还有多少正义的成分?相信和我一样有不幸遭遇的人们定有所共鸣。

然而当充满铜臭下来谈正义,这里面还有多少正义可言,而自然而然的移民及少数族裔首当其冲成为受害者也见怪不怪了。

我是对律师们没多大好感,因为他们毁了我的生活;然当律师的职业成为商业,而律师不再为正义而战,那么我的遭遇也是正常不过的。

其实真正毁了我的不是仅仅是律师,而是这极其官僚的制度,尤其是那些带着有色眼镜,将其本身英法文化之争的情绪混淆在其职责而胡乱左右我们命运的官僚们。而这不仅仅反映在我的问题上,从一个个向我救助的人们的事件来看亦是如此。

我以前曾提醒过大家,差不多所有的投诉中心不过是蒙蔽民众的花瓶--本人是一而再、再而三的体会并领悟了它的"好处";在此我再一次提醒大家:我的经历再次证实了这一点。

歧视不仅仅在于肤色人种及文化差异,歧视以各种各样的形色出现并发生在各个领域各个层次。歧视带来的伤痛不仅仅是受害者本身,更深深损害了加国及魁省社会的和谐。

因此,我除对联邦、魁省总理齐声指责 JAN WANG 表示异议,对国会施压要环球邮报向社会道歉的做法深表遗憾之外,再次全力声援 JAN WONG!

总理先生们,你们是两级政府的领头羊,想想你们在竞选时的承诺;而国会议员大人们口口声声都表示是代表民众监督政府的,为什么都无法象 JAN WONG 一样去发现本质及隐患呢?
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74#
发表于 2006-10-2 23:49 | 只看该作者
我所提及的是我1997 年时的心态,故在你发表你的观点的时候,最好不要断章取义。至于我现在的心态如何,我究竟为什么一而再、再而三坚持不懈的要求政府还我公道,相信你可能暂时无法理解。

如想进一步了解我的心态,不妨向生活在我周围的打听一二,或直接和我面谈再作定论不迟。一个从死亡边缘闯过来而再获重生的人的心态不是一般常人所能体会的。不然我亦不会经常在网上为他人提供方便,通过电话或面谈为他人解难排忧。

JAN WONG 并没有凭空猜测,而是通过这一系列的现象探讨它的实质和隐患从而提醒主流社会急需关注·和警惕平等正义对各个层次民众的重要性。

无需就我的不幸来进行推测臆想,不妨走访走访就华人社团内近期所发生在其他人士中的一些歧视、诈骗等不公的事列,甚至不妨尽你能力为他们获得正义奔走一二, 然后再回头看看你现在的观点如何。

斗胆说一句:先生在发表高论时,最好了解一下事情的来龙去脉,而在尚未阅读其文章前便断然否定,或将某人的遭遇断章取义,鄙人实在无法体会到其中有什么积极或实际的意义。

言不达意,还望海涵。
Post by vipkj
个人十分理解你的心情,如果一个人遇到不公正待遇的时候,那里的天都是灰的.正因为如此,你现在的观点一定是带有倾向性的,这种倾向性对于你个人问题的解决是有益的.但是对这次无辜被杀害的学生是不公正的.我本人只能有保留的支持Jan Wong.如果她能看到这个帖子的话,我希望她能去采访那个康大教授和阿尔及利亚青年来证明自己的正确性,毕竟以猜测和个人经历来写文章不符合一个职业记者的要求.现在Jan Wong要救自己,那需要的是证据,证据,证据!!!!!!!!!
还有我可以十分肯定的告诉你,我在加拿大曾遭到讲英语和法语的人士的排斥和歧视,并非你所说的一帆风顺.
还有你说你曾经动过那种念头,说明你的心态真的不是很好.但是我也支持你和他们斗争,并且我认为你比那些忍气吞声,或者漠不关心的人强的多的多的多!
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75#
发表于 2006-10-3 00:22 | 只看该作者

汉人在被满清短暂的几百年奴役之后就已经完全归化,


那你在这里发帖子为什么还用汉字,不用满文?你祖先不是汉人?
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76#
发表于 2006-10-3 01:56 | 只看该作者
你们这些通知, 喜欢玩文字游戏, 在英文里叫: swimming in the words...

为什么引用前面而忽略后面呢? = > "你可以说汉人同化了满人, 但几十年前, 却为什么放弃了同化日本人呢? "



Post by wustorm

汉人在被满清短暂的几百年奴役之后就已经完全归化,


那你在这里发帖子为什么还用汉字,不用满文?你祖先不是汉人?
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77#
发表于 2006-10-3 07:26 | 只看该作者
我在某种意义上支持JOAN WONG的观点,她的观点并不等于她支持那些人用暴力来反抗对他们不公正的社会体制和文化.尽管主流社会似乎在同声声讨她,但目前至少有两位保守党议员对魁北克的封闭文化批评,还有总督女士.

这是个自由的国家,每个人都有权发表自己的观点.七君子的观点也在于此.我们应该听到不同的观点,而不是华人社会就是一个声音,因为我们不在大陆.

JOAN WONG很有勇气,做为一个少数族裔,敢向主流社会发出尖锐的批评.我看目前在主流媒体上发表如此大胆的批评的华裔只有她.

在一个悲剧发生之后,整个社会都需要反思,不然悲剧还会重演.JOAN WONG从她的角度反思,尽管尖刻令当地社会无法接受,但是事实上魁省的封闭和对外来移民的种种限制是根源之一.

移民是艰难的,没有蛋糕在加拿大等着我们.我们的权利是需要我们自己用合法手段去争取的,尽管时间漫长.
Post by deland
我看不是君子,就算JAN WONG做了什么错事,从哪个角度上也轮不到他们跳出来,就是哪个华人犯了弥天大罪被人砍了脑袋,也没有他们过去再踢一脚的道理,如果他们写信只是申明JAN WONG的言论不代表他们,那没有什么,其实哪个人也代表不了别人,我没听人说JAN WONG写那篇文章是想代表他们7个,他们写一封废话信以示划清界线也就罢了,有什么资格要求JAN WONG向他们道歉,伤害他们热爱魁北克的感情的言论很多,为什么不敢写信要求别的族裔的人向他们道歉?只因为她跟这7个人是同一个族裔?天啊,她可是真不幸,JAN WONG的观点对错我不知道,但我认为应当支持她,别人可以随便对中国的事大放厥词,中国人有话为什么就不敢说出来.
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78#
发表于 2006-10-3 08:25 | 只看该作者
满人聪明的地方就是保留了汉人的习俗和文化,因为他们知道强迫一个拥有巨大人口和悠久历史的民族去放弃自己的文化会造成他们的不断的反抗,对于满清政府来说绝对不是件好事。
我们摒除抢占印第安人的土地的过错,法国人确实先进驻加拿大的,英国人进入加拿大时动用大量资金想要把法国人赶走。他们的方式是把有文化和经济能力的法国人强行送走,目的是可以更好的控制和奴役剩下的法国人。
如果换作中国人,我们能不捍卫我们的文化吗?就象当初若不是满人保留了我们的文化,汉人早就造反无数次了,为的就是捍卫我们的文化。试想我们也象魁北克人一样不被允许说自己的语言(当初英国人曾经禁止魁北克人说法语)的话会怎样?就象犹太人,没有国家的民族,失去了定居地的民族,可是至今为止,分散到各地,他们还是保留了它们的语言,宗教,和习俗。而且到现在他们还是不迟疑的告诉人们他们是犹太人。他们是好样的!所以魁北克人捍卫他们的文化有什么错呢?现在我们中国人也分散在各地,有没有人站出来说我们不要我们的文化了?


Post by wustorm

汉人在被满清短暂的几百年奴役之后就已经完全归化,


那你在这里发帖子为什么还用汉字,不用满文?你祖先不是汉人?
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79#
发表于 2006-10-3 09:06 | 只看该作者
捍卫法裔文化本身没有错,错是错在某些官僚大人们将捍卫本民族文化和自己职责权力范围混淆了。再说社会是在进步的,不能将一百年前的满清和加国社会的现状划等同。其次,加拿大是移民国家,这一点上和中国的国情亦不尽相同。

况且,今天的加拿大对魁省的宽容是大家有目共睹的。记得90年我在犹太人那里担任厨师一职时,曾经和一位QUEBECOIS点心厨师探讨就为什么他们要搞独立的问题时,他说:其实没有人真正想独立,这是一个为我们争取更多权力的筹码。。。

为了争取更多的权力,其结果蒙城由北美最大的城市之一黯然退出为多伦多取而代之,经济从此一蹶不振,深受其害的不仅仅是少数族裔,而是留在魁省的法裔本身。。。
Post by shabu
满人聪明的地方就是保留了汉人的习俗和文化,因为他们知道强迫一个拥有巨大人口和悠久历史的民族去放弃自己的文化会造成他们的不断的反抗,对于满清政府来说绝对不是件好事。
我们摒除抢占印第安人的土地的过错,法国人确实先进驻加拿大的,英国人进入加拿大时动用大量资金想要把法国人赶走。他们的方式是把有文化和经济能力的法国人强行送走,目的是可以更好的控制和奴役剩下的法国人。
如果换作中国人,我们能不捍卫我们的文化吗?就象当初若不是满人保留了我们的文化,汉人早就造反无数次了,为的就是捍卫我们的文化。试想我们也象魁北克人一样不被允许说自己的语言(当初英国人曾经禁止魁北克人说法语)的话会怎样?就象犹太人,没有国家的民族,失去了定居地的民族,可是至今为止,分散到各地,他们还是保留了它们的语言,宗教,和习俗。而且到现在他们还是不迟疑的告诉人们他们是犹太人。他们是好样的!所以魁北克人捍卫他们的文化有什么错呢?现在我们中国人也分散在各地,有没有人站出来说我们不要我们的文化了?
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80#
发表于 2006-10-3 09:15 | 只看该作者

STRONGLY SUPPORT FOR THE ARTICLE OF "GET UNDER DESK"—ADDITI

Dear Editor and Madam Jan Wong: [email="jwong@globeandmail.ca,Newsroom@globeandmail.com"]jwong@globeandmail.ca,Newsroom@globeandmail.com[/email]


Since your article published, it became a hot subject in our Chinese society. Just from www.sinoquebec.com/bbs the thread of 让我们支持Jan Wong ( 1 2 3 ) , it brought us join with this great discussion. And I realized, more than 90% of Chinese are stand your side since you said truth, which no one wants to really talking about especially with Medias.


I personal experienced when Ami Quebec wish to bring my story to have an attention with medias--but no one want to publish my story. As they said, they feel sorry for me, but they don't want to involve since my story is too sensitive...

Some victims living with similar situation like me, they are contacting with me and wish I would give them some advise from my life experience what I went through. In this Sunday afternoon, we will have a meeting to support each other, and we all ready to support you.

Just from my case, you may already see the problem:Summer of 1990, I was insulted by two MUC Police officer as a killer at Van Horn Park when I brought my family visited Jamaica festival; when I went to station request they apologize to me, MUC put my name check if I have some bad record before they talk to me...

April 28, 1991, without our family members knowing, the doctor stopped medication treatment of my father's lung cancel treatment for three days till we discovered, and then my father died at Jewish General Hospital few days later;

Summer of 1992, I brought my daughter to St-Justin Children Hospital because her high fever and they put her for special care, which we were waiting from 9:00pm till next day 5:00am, people came much late than us already back to their home, and we were still waiting. When I asked them why, the counter several people asked me why I don't speak French since this is Quebec...

November 30, 1995, my late wife was sent by ambulance to Montreal General Hospital for trauma third degree injury--the hospital delay 7 hours for the surgery, and before that they even never thought need to reduce her head blood pressure...

Moreover, on Dec.4 1995, the hospital promised that they would try their best to survive her (the medical expenses even were not from the government, which covered by responsible party's insurance company), but just next day morning, without I knowing, the doctor signed article 99 to let her die (she died on December 8, 1995)...

December 2, 1995 YWCA sent a "lawyer" (Enza Martuccilli) from their own legal clinic for legal and family support, which this person was court order for community service that she was no longer as a lawyer and with criminal record, and I got personal fraud $20,000 from her...

January 1996, MUC Police used me as an witness to against my boss who has Chinese mafia background, which I spent my own expenses forced the his restaurant went to bankruptcy, and I took over to let the employees to keep the job; but once those mafia put more pressure on me, MUC Police just simply told me I better to relocate my business since those are dangerous people...

July 1996, MUC Police convinced me as their witness again to against Enza Martuccilli for public interests with a promise would try their best to protect me if she cost me trouble. But once I provide my evidence, my life totally destroyed:

Different of inspectors came to my restaurant to check if I did anything wrong; the mafia came eat for free and break down things; threaten phone calls... Moreover, I got second fraud since Enza Martuccili convinced one of my employee cooperate with her;

By then, all kind seemly impossible happened things it happened to my life: from MUC Police witness, I became a defender at the civil court; both suspects illegally ran my business for three years, which even got compensation from my landlord, and removed my restaurant and hidden my assets away since MUC Police refused to involve, instead keep telling me that I need lawyers since this is "civil"...

The unbelievable thing is: MUC Police even refused to catch both of them although Enza Martuccilli is facing for criminal court arrest order; moreover, when I made personal appearance to the superior court to made the justice system realized I am the victim, which was not a defender, and MUC Police reduced to take any action even I found both suspects and my assets where then were hidden...

The worst thing is I was immolated by MUC Police again in June 30, 2001 that they kicked me out from my own premise of my new restaurant, which it totally destroyed my hope to turn over the page, forget the past and rebuild my new life since MUC Police refused to correct the mistake they made…

I had great personal experiences with government, legal and justice system once I stopped idea to done justice by my own: when I return the gun, and I walked in to Jewish General Hospital asking for help in 1997. By then I found more discrimination element through on the way to keep knocking for justice:

The social status, the race, especially when they discovered that I only knew how to speak English and I don’t understand French at all, many Quebec government agencies the first question was asked me why I don’t learn French since I already being here for many years? How could I suppose answer for it? Said truth because the immigration office doesn’t let me to take the course or just lie to them, which nothing would satisfy their wonders anyhow; by then how possibly for me to receive fair treatment?

By the fact, discrimination is everywhere compare with US; just Canada doesn’t want to face it. Just looks at the way the treatment I received from the hospital, there is another element of discrimination:

Right after when I changed my mind and went into Jewish General Hospital asking for help, I was shocked to learn that the patients in mental institution almost have no basic rights; but no one could see anything about, otherwise you will in trouble: I was been locked on the bed for punishment just because I told one of the nurse when he treated another patient very badly…

There was no one really care about your health, and the psychiatry doctor only care is the patient’ body comical balance, but they never thought most the important thing for mental patients are the spiritual and soul healing besides of those comical pills; 5 years of depression treatment it caused me became as robot plus the worst of side-effects suffering…

Moreover, when my social worker mistakenly convinced my doctor locked me in at Jewish General Hospital again in year 2002, when the doctor who is in charge for the mental institution learned that five years the treatment they did on me only ruined my health, and I did recovered by Chinese medical treatment, it made him lost face, he tried to make a deal to let me continue back on his medication and let me free…

Once I refused, they tried to put all kind pressure on me and my family: locked me on the bed for punishment and force medication treatment, cut down my family visit time and cut my phone communicate time with my family and outside; put more pressure on my wife and called Child Care Centre try to take away our baby from the family; lie to the superior court about my situation and try to get court order for medication and lock me in the mental institution for life…

For the legal and justice system, which I already mentioned on my first letter; recently I received a refusal letter again from the Police Ethics Commissioner, which although Mr. Kevin Bilodeau from Quebec Minister Office repeatedly convinced me do believe the system that the Police Ethics Commissioner will take care my matter seriously in this time since the minister office is putting attention on it…

so from above of these, if both our minister Mr. Stephen Haber and Mr. Jean Charest still claim the government provide great system for the citizens especially claim the government system do care the minority societies also, then how could explain the numbers unfair happened to me and to the others who had been immolated by the legal and justice system, which never get no where—the comment thing we made it happen is: the lawyers are getting more and more richer and it no matter what could be happened with us…

So the only thing left me to do is, try to use my life experience to support the others and possibly advice them in order for them avoid the terrible life I am experienced.

God blessing…
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